#2 Re: LT38 » please firewall ! » 19.09.2017 10:56:32

This looks like an automated response.

#3 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 13.09.2017 13:16:44

I think there are too many governments as it is. It would be better if there were fewer types of governments, but more social effects that can be combined, like in Alpha Centauri. There there were four sets with four effects each and you could choose one from each set and combine them. They all gave some + and some - and, in the end, you had 256 combinations. Also, you needed to discover tech to unlock an effect.

This probably cuoldn't be done here without heavy coding, but social effects can be manipulated with wonders that can be used like thise effects.


Anyway, this is a different topic so I continued and expanded it here:
http://forum.freeciv.org/f/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=86875

#4 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 12.09.2017 12:22:40

wieder wrote:

As an example I can't think of any reason to switch to tribalism in the late game.

Well, there could be a reason if it's justified game-mechanically, but that is contrary to what I think game of Civilization should be about wink And I have a feeling that constant c+w=30 is more about game mechanics than about the nature of the game.

#5 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 12.09.2017 11:50:12

Well, removing WS was only a conceptual idea. Thinking about it, WS is exactly what I said: a shortcut and, depending on playstyle, a necessity, therefore no need to make a decision, you either build it or fail. And Civ should be about decisions. Or you can make a decision to *not* go into playsyle where you'd need WS so... Huh, it's getting complicated. But, all things considered, you can still build a police station.

...

About stealing techs, even with 50% base chance and 100% defence bonus, this only means you need two diplomats vs. undefended city two more per defending diplomat, so I wouldn't call it too hard, only "having a price"

Keep in mind that defending also has a price, but also that, in the end, they won't be TOO expensive and also that diplomats do not require upkeep. So you can pile them up over a longer period.

...

About governments, it would really be nice to have some feeling of historic progress. I'd make corruption+waste 20% with Democracy, 25% with Republic, Monarchy and Communism. Actually, *I* would make an ever bigger discount, but you wouldn't accept that big_smile Anyway, keep in mind that Democracy in original Civ has no waste and corruption wink

#6 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 11.09.2017 17:12:20

It is difficult to wage war and 30% waste can be very expensive.

Anyway, about spy_resistant, final proposal: Barracks, Courthouse and Police Station give 30% each.

#7 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 11.09.2017 11:29:43

Anyway, about Democracy, yes, it is too little appealing compared to others. This is why I would like to drop constant corruption+waste, but then it may become too strong, which is why I was considering also dropping WS. it's not a drastic nerf because you can always build Police stations. WS is only a shortcut inherited from Civ 1.

#8 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 11.09.2017 11:23:12

Wait, I wrote a longish reply yesterday and I don't see it here... is it possible that I didn't click "Submit"? Oh hell...

#9 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 11.09.2017 11:21:35

"Spy_Resistant"  - if a spy specifies a target for sabotage,
                   then she  has an AMOUNT percent chance to fail.  Also in
                   diplomatic combat defending diplomatic units in cities will
                   get an AMOUNT percent bonus.

#10 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 10.09.2017 16:07:06

Yeah, that's what I meant. Can't set it to be easier than other hostile actions, but don't make it harder.

As for a building, I'd give that flag to courthouse. It actually works only if there is a defending diplomat. If there isn't, 50% (or more, personally, I'd go for 100) of 0 is still 0 wink So, when there is trade incoming, just inform a friend which city is clear and, when the trade is done, get defence back in.

Also, I'd go with roughly 20% bulb loss (for the receiver) when getting tech that way. It may not amount to much if you're playing chess, but it does make sense in the big picture.

And I would be VERY MUCH in favour in editing the tech tree so that ALL techs get root_reqs.

Edit: maybe give spy resistance like, 50 to courthouse and 50 to police station?


On a slightly unrelated topic, I'm playing with the idea of making Democracy a bit stronger, with less waste/corruption, but removing Womens Suffrage completely. It would make sense. Think about it.

#11 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 10.09.2017 15:42:09

Check the Spy_Resistant effect.

About chances, yes, if they are not 100%, then diplomats should be cheaper. But I think that chance to steal tech in that case should still be 100% because, if not, it would mean it's easier to sabotage and incite vs. enemy than get tech from a friend (and still have to pay for it).

And just checking, stealing isn't considered a hostile action, right? Can you do this without actually being at war?

#12 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 10.09.2017 13:47:54

A few thoughts.


The more I think about it, the more idea about tech-trading through diplomat thefts sounds neat (still want to try the normal tech trade with penalties, though, but that's a discussion for another game). However, usually a diplomat can't steal a tech twice from the same city. is this a ruleset thing or is it coded? if the former, can it be removed? If coded, is there a way around it?


It would be nice to give defensive diplomats a lot advantage when trying to prevent tech theft. At lčeast 50% bonus when in a city would be cool, preferably even more. It doesn't prevent theft completely because an attacker can come in with more diplomats. Especially if he can steal tech more times from the same city.


Maybe make diplomats and spies non-cheap? I don't know what was the idea, but 30 may be too little. I'd say 40-60 would be a good optimum?


No losing tech if you get robbed, please?


I hope you are not going to impose tax on money exchange. In a non-alliance-victory setting, there will be very little abuse. And besides, the idea of money is that, when someone gets it, someone else loses it so all trades should be fine. MAYBE, just MAYBE have 5-10% tax for "manipulation costs". Or, is it possible to tie the tax amount to government? 30% in Despotism to 5% in Democracy?


I never liked the idea of corruption+waste being constant across governments and I understand it's been around for a long time, but have never seen a proper discussion about it. I have a feeling it has been inherited for ages without giving it much thought.

#13 Re: LT40 » About the theme for LT40 » 07.09.2017 18:29:55

Hm, it seems I mixed up 39 and 40 regarding some settings. Will need to reread everything...

#14 Re: LT39 » Any changes you would like to see for a more traditional game? » 07.09.2017 08:38:43

Gh, sorry, lapsus cerebri. Drafted riflemen are *third* cheap unit in a row, correct? So, why obsolete them at all? This way you are obsoleting a cheap emergency unit  with a fully functional one.

#15 Re: LT39 » Any changes you would like to see for a more traditional game? » 06.09.2017 20:43:37

Why wouldn't Drafted Riflemen be obsoleted with Partisans?

#16 Re: LT39 » The speed of the science? » 06.09.2017 15:56:52

You mean LT37 had 60% *cost* for science?

I think that, if there is no tech exchange, 100% is just fine. If it's faster, you don't really get to use units before they get obsolete.

#17 Re: LT39 » Any changes you would like to see for a more traditional game? » 05.09.2017 20:54:24

Well, maybe that's the problem of too high veteran levels. I would say that +50% on first kill, +25% on the second etc. is overpowered. And, basically, when analysing if a game setting is a bit off regarding multiplayer gameplay and realism, my initial test is: was it inherited from Sid Meier's Civilization 1? If the answer is "yes", that is a marker to start doubting. Think about that. Because Civ1 was a brilliant single-player game designed to create programmed obstacles for the player to gain a personal sense of achievement when overcoming them. However, a multiplayer has a COMPLETELY different philosophy. For example, look at Wonders. A perfect concept for a single player game. But when it got to multiplayer, they simply had to be reformed into Small Wonders.

But that's a different topic wink

Anyway, I have a problem with military units costing population, especially two population because then it is a slaughter. But, again, maybe it's just me wink It all depends how you base your concepts. I'd give lower veteran levels and weaker Drafted units, maybe with them requiring no upkeep. But a few of those settings need to be combined so it's all about the whole concept, not picking this or that setting.

And I'd suggest different names: Minutemen or Regulars and Conscripts Recruits or Guardsmen. And why obsolete with Marines? This makes it possible to build a shitload and then upgrade, and also removes the possibility to build cheaper units after that.

#18 Re: LT39 » Any changes you would like to see for a more traditional game? » 05.09.2017 17:05:11

Whar I had in mind was more of a cannon fodder unit, cheap and not a great loss to lose. Population is a considerable loss. So, in the end, these partisans seem like a pretty expensive thing: 40 shields AND 1 population. To me it seems like too much. But, again, that's only my opinion. Others should share their view, too, I have feeling that I'm the only one babbling here smile

#19 Re: LT39 » Any changes you would like to see for a more traditional game? » 05.09.2017 15:29:37

What I am generally missing in mid- and late-game are cheap unprofessional defensive units that can be raised /built quickly in case of emergency, to stop a sudden breakthrough and slow down an invading force. In late game this can be partisans that are not really used that much, but could be slightly cheapened and weakened to serve the purpose, but in mid-game I'm missing something like Militia or Minutemen. Early game has Warriors that are just fine, but they disappear with the appearance of Musketeers. I was toying with tilesets and basically took the Musketeers image and made it black&white, but I couldn't get it working.

#21 Re: ScenarioGame 1 » SG1 is based on LT38, but you can pick some features from LT40 if » 04.09.2017 22:02:58

Personally, I don't like the flagship idea and also early units for some governments. It isn't realistic and doesn't connect well to the feeling of Civilization. It's more like some of the gazillion RTS's in the market.

But, like I said, that's personal. I'm still not sure if I am going to play that game. (40)

#22 Re: ScenarioGame 1 » Winning or ending the first Scenario Game? » 04.09.2017 21:55:59

Well, what techs are available? Are we using only the 19th century techs? If yes, science should be slowed down tenfold and end with, I don't know, electricity?

#24 Re: LT40 » The ruleset for LT40 has been updated » 31.08.2017 20:03:55

wieder wrote:

- immigrats (cost 30) will replace migrants with railroad
- colonists (cost 50) will replace settlers with railroads

What would be the purpose for this?

#25 Re: New Games » New type of team game » 31.08.2017 18:15:49

Still, is it possible for more people to be logged into the same nation at the same time?

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