#1 12.11.2017 12:13:55

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,105

Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

What kind of changes should there be for the WW1 scenario?

It's probably needed to ignore actual years. Can't really have ruleset changes making the game to actually run the real years so maybe better to ignore this.

The start techs? Probably WW1 level techs are needed but what are thos exactly?

How expensive should it be to research new techs and should there be a "barrier" to prevent the players (easily) from researching too advanced stuff like nukes and stealth units. The techs could be made more expensive by changing the actual costs for each of them. This is not really too much work if we only know where to start from. What would be the first techs that should be "too expensive"?

Also, is there need to adjust some specific WW1 techs or create some WW1 specific buildings? How to deal with unhappiness?

How to give the players more reasons to keep units on the front for simulating the stationary war? Or is there a reason to do that at all?

Probably some later units need to be available before they would be in a regular Freeciv game. Like Tanks and maybe howitzers? How to change the actual values for those units?

And the map. Should the game be once again with 2x moves? How did the 2x moves work in SG1?

Anything else? Please don't hesitate mentioning or listing stuff. Rants are also welcome smile

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#2 12.11.2017 18:08:30

Butters
Player
Posts: 2

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

maybe days could be used instead.
start with riflemen calvary, artillery,  Submarines, Dreadnoughts and Battle Cruisers.  ww1 artillery/machine guns took four or more men to use, they could be expensive to replace and hard to move. research tanks, storm troops, planes
research Chemical weapons: tear gas> chlorine gas> phosgene gas> mustard gas.  (deployed with grenades,artillery and canisters)
Zeppelins: "Plant for the manufacture of hydrogen."..."Dirigible sheds"  for reconnaissance missions, bombing runs and  transport of a few units or diplomats. "Bombing raids carried along with aeroplanes,  caused diversion of men and equipment from the Western Front and fear of the raids had some effect on industrial production."
how are you going to simulate tiles with trenches? maybe move much faster once you past them ....are there medics in freeciv?

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#3 12.11.2017 19:34:23

Caedo
Player
From: Germany
Posts: 34

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

Zeppelins are definitely something I'd support, but I'm afraid the Freeciv 2.5 clients don't supply graphics for those, so that could cause some confusion later on in the game.
Trenches could effectively be some sort of pre-fortress. Remember, a single tile in Freeciv represents a huge area, so it's not going to slow units down big-time.
Medics are currently not possible. That is to say, I couldn't find any way to make them work. It's not possible to simply give them an effect by virtue of being there; I think there are some theoretical ways to do it via voodoo lua script, but those are pretty complicated and will confuse players.

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#4 12.11.2017 19:40:54

Sketlux
Player
From: Germany
Posts: 80

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

The start techs? Probably WW1 level techs are needed but what are thos exactly?

I implemented all the techs already. Havent taken a look recently but they should be anno 1900 or WWI like.

Also, is there need to adjust some specific WW1 techs or create some WW1 specific buildings? How to deal with unhappiness?

"Well, when I think of WWI  a lot of things come into my mind:
-Zeppelin bombing;  no grafics (although I tried a little http://forum.freeciv.org/f/viewtopic.ph … 0&start=10)
-Tanks, though no Mark I ...
-submarines, we already have them
Here it gets maybe interesting
-Shock troops like the Arditi or the Sturmtruppen
-Poison Gas
-Flamethrowers
-Unrestricted submarine warfare
-Haber–Bosch process
-synchronization gear
I don't know the capabilities and restrictions of longturn but could be included as inventions?
Giving:
-shock troop tactics: bonus for infantry (and maybe artillery) when attacking fortresses? (same with flamethrowers)
-Poison gas: make artillery stronger
-Flamethrower: make infantry stronger when attacking fortified positions
-Unrestricted submarine warfare: make sub stronger
-Haber–Bosch process: reducing the cost of artillery
-synchronization gear: make figthers stronger
These are small inventions but they could be cheap an optional tech that end in dead lock in the tech tree.
In terms of units, what are the restrictions of my imagination? "

From:

http://forum.longturn.org/viewtopic.php?id=800

What about strikes? Can we program to happen puting prodcution to an halt? How often could depend on various factors, depending on governments, luxury, troops abroad etc...

Last edited by Sketlux (12.11.2017 19:45:53)

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#5 12.11.2017 20:54:59

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 391

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

It is always impolite to give a lot of  ideas that someone else would have to work to implement, but you asked, so...

I think that for WWI - or any such time-restricted scenario - you have to rewrite the tech tree from scratch. So, you need to get several types of armour, each slightly better than the previous, various types of infantry, maybe different types of submarines... But, to be honest, there wasn't much tech progress during the WWI.

The Nuke effect can act as gas bombs.

Also, this may be a good opportunity to make two tweaks that may result in a drastically different gameplay.

1. Kill Stack off
2. Artillery has a "Bombarder" flag. However, don't give it too much power so that you need piles of them to have a devastating effect.

These two things combined could have the effect you are looking for: shitloads of units stacked against each other on the front in a small space with a very static situation, slow advances and constant and senseless pounding of the enemy. Yes, that would then take much of the players' time, doing the same thing over and over again, but if the soldiers in the trenches suffer so much, why would you have it any better? tongue besides, that's what a WWI scenario should be all about wink

Last edited by Corbeau (12.11.2017 20:57:17)

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#6 29.11.2017 13:14:31

Lord_P
Player
Posts: 137

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

+1 for Bombard artillery. I actually think artillery should work like that in the normal game, so cannons + infantry can shift that single musket on a mountain...

Killstack Off may not work as you expect as it makes it easy to move stacks around so they are more mobile. Maybe cheaper/tougher workers and removing the restrictions on fortress building in one turn (Just for the scenario) would result in WW1 style trench building.

Also +1 for nukes as gas... but with a range of 2 moves! (From a city or airbase that the enemy can see you building). So they are a last resort that will probably hit your own units too.

Sub warfare was a big part of WW1, but a fundamental aspect of it is missing in CIV..
Different behavior of subs on surface and submerged. If there was some way to switch unit types at turn change (A script that switches all Sentried subs?), Surfaced would be fast with long vision range but also v weak in attack and defence, Sumerged would be very slow, invisible and have high attack and improved defence.

Last edited by Lord_P (29.11.2017 13:25:18)

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#7 29.11.2017 13:30:26

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 391

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

Lord_P wrote:

Killstack Off may not work as you expect as it makes it easy to move stacks around so they are more mobile. Maybe cheaper/tougher workers and removing the restrictions on fortress building in one turn (Just for the scenario) would result in WW1 style trench building.

Make them less mobile, then. Maybe even go for movement x1, as in original Civ, only for this scenario. (WW1, static, etc.)

But more importantly: since the role of explorers, spies, partisans and special troops was negligible in WW1 combat, remove "Ignore ZOC" flag altogether. Then your stacks can be mobile all you want, but if they can't go around that one dug in infantry, there is no use. Also, if a unit has "Ignore terrain" flag, restrict that unit's base movement. (Or is this "Treat all tiles as roads?")

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#8 29.11.2017 14:12:04

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,105

Re: Ruleset changes for WW1 scenario?

Not sure if it would be possible to let the submarines to "fortify" -> stay submerged. If this can be done it would be one way to simulate this. As a result you wouldn't be able to "see" enemy ships moving past your sub waking it up. If not online that is.

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