#1 20.01.2018 12:35:17

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,219

More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

This is more like a listing of rough ideas that are just ideas. Some of these I got from other people and some were from me. These are not actual plans. Comments are welcome.

Submarines moving spies would be able to move on rivers. This would allow less developed nations to better steal from those who have more techs. Then again might not be that realistic and not such a great idea because of that.

Governments without trade bonus would have some kind of production bonus or some production bonus would work better for them. Nothing as powerful as the trade bonus is. Could be something that would become available around invention.

Republic getting no free units at all. Not sure about this and might be too much together with the bonus for govs without production bonus. Then again without the production bonus this might even the govs.

The governments might get a slight boost for the city sizes with some techs. And the original empire sizes could be slightly smaller. No buildings needed. Just techs.

If the idea of drafted musketeers work there could be some type of more early drafted unit costing population. This might be needed if republic has no free units. Would be a method of stopping an enemy at some point if not that many permanent units can be afforded.

Everyone loves to make the capital city the wonder city where production is used for buildings. Might be interesting if some early game stuff could only be made in the capital. In the ancient times the capital was the center of the knowledge and it would make sense to do something like that.

The diplomats are nice but also hard to use for embassies. This might be too wild but in the ancient times information was not moved that fast and the people might not have understood that easily who is the enemy and who is not. Not sure if it would be possible, but the diplomats could have stealth capabilities until at least one of the players would learn maybe feudalism or trade. Both kind of something that makes the world smaller or create a new kind of social system where people know more about the nation they are living in.

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#2 20.01.2018 17:34:50

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 463

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

Before reading the post, you said that LT41 will be more classical. Also, we did mention that we could use my ruleset for LT42 wink (Which is exactly how I want to go down in history! 42! Yay! big_smile )

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#3 20.01.2018 17:46:16

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 463

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

*After* reading the post, actually, I had some thoughts along the same lines.

First: production for low-trade governments: I have an idea about Five Year Plan wonders: five in a row, can only be built in capital, each adds one production to each city, each costs 100 shields more. Work only under Communism, once Communism is gone, the effect is also gone.

Submarines able to enter rivers is a neat idea, but not very powerful. A weak unit sneaking into enemy territory is a one-way mission. On the other hand, if used well it could do a nice effect. And maybe a one-way mission to steal some tech is just what we're looking for.

Similar thing goes for early stealth diplomats. Not much effect, really. It's enough that a worker sits near it and he's toast. But no harm in having it, I guess.

How about the idea I mentioned several (dozen) times: contact and diplomacy are possible without diplomats, only with units meeting each other, and then "contact" lasts for X turns? Much easier to make alliances this way (due to game-mechanics limitation), also exchanging maps is always good etc.

I didn't understand this: "The governments might get a slight boost for the city sizes with some techs. And the original empire sizes could be slightly smaller. No buildings needed. Just techs."

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#4 20.01.2018 21:36:16

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,219

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

Yes, we could use your ruleset for LT42. Do you think it might work for a two team game?

Five Year Plan Wonders... I must admit that I know very little about the actual wonder like buildings or project from the era. The small wonders only affect thge city and while good idea, the trade bonus govs get the bonus for all the cities. A bigger commie empire might not get big enough boost. Maybe doing both? For communism there might be some short era of prosperity. Some people here claim that in the Soviet Union communism worked better from the 40's to the early 70's. Some tech could activate this boost and some remove it. Maybe.

Subs moving on the rivers would be just for that. For spy operations. I was thinking about having some more modern ships after triremes moving on the rivers but somehow moving military units feel like too much. The triremes have serious limitations on units they can move and also not being able to move on deep ocean. For subs one way missions for sure smile

The contact turns might add to the game, yes. Maybe that could be done if the traditional tech trading doesn't return. Two sides to it. With that easy embassy it would be hard to keep secrets. Maybe... maybe...

The last part. It's the old idea about growing the empire sizes in increments.

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#5 20.01.2018 23:02:22

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 463

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

I don't see my ruleset as appropriate for a team game. Team game is about war while I think this would be good for overall development, progress etc. Besides, when would be a good time for a team game, June or August or both?

Five Year Plans (two were executed, third was interrupted by WWII) launched USSR from feudal backwardness into an industrial superpower. There were social costs and mistakes made, but the result was nevertheless undisputed.

I don't  understand what you mean by "small wonders only affect thge city". They can affect the whole nation, can't they? So, 5yrPlans would give one shield to *every* city. The bigger the empire, the more the benefit. Maybe I should think of something to benefit the smaller ones, too.

About stability of Communism, USSR and Yugoslavia. However, in Cuba, Vietnam and China it is quite alive and well so I don't think we can make final conclusions about its longevity. And at the moment, China seems more stable and has a better future prospects than any of the major western capitalist countries, while USA is on the brink of economic, social and political collapse.

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#6 21.01.2018 12:29:25

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,219

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

Ok. If it's not for a team game then we will do a teamless one. Just checking. One possibility is that we could use the LT40 ruleset and do a very different team game. One with a space race victory or with someone playing in anarchy and taking the extra cities. Would be something different and require new strategies.

Or maybe using the LT39 ruleset for the team game. The best time for a team game, a two team game, is probably launching it in Q2. During the summer time there are more idlers and delegations and with a two team game that's more easy to manage.

Yeah, small wonders can affect all the cities. I somehow misread the idea about affecting each city. Now I only wonder if it would be possible to do this in some other way instead of small wonders. Techs is one way... Would it be possible to give production boost is there is a unit in the city? For communism it would make sense to have a political unit in the city. Without special political units I guess spy would do it. And with a spy in each city the enemy could also create trouble by killing those. Not sure if possible to implement, but it would be kind of extension to the same idea that units keep the citizens content and that way boost production.

One very good point mmm2 often made was that the smaller nations didn't get that much advantage from the wonders affecting all the cities.

Good point about the communism. China is kind of exception and similar communism is hard to make. I wonder what would be the penalty for a China like communism?

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#7 21.01.2018 12:36:27

wieder
Administrator
Posts: 1,219

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

Also listing here some more thoughts.

- making tribalism less powerful by changing the number of free units from 4 to 3.
- making despotism more tempting by making the pyramids production boost to work only on despotism and monarchy. removing the production penalty would still work on tribalism.
- boosting monarchy by giving it one more free unit

Should fundamentalism become available with monotheism instead of theology?

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#8 21.01.2018 15:45:29

Corbeau
Player
Posts: 463

Re: More possible or impossible ideas for the next more experimental game

One more idea about giovernments that I'm implementing: reverse tax/sci control. A despot has full control over his nation so he can get 90%. Under Democracy, however, the government is bount by constitution, parliament, all kinds of social contracts and can get a maximum of 50% on anything. This is not so limiting as it sounds because, with 3 bags, and Luxuries always being between 10% and 30% there is still a lot of room for manoeuvre, but still. (and other governments being somewhere in between).

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